Some people look at our 8.1 percent unemployment rate and say, there aren’t enough jobs out there. But others say there are plenty, Americans just aren’t willing to do them. One of those people is John Stossel, host of “Stossel” on the Fox Business Network.

Stossel did a Fox News special called “Out of Work,” where he argues that there are plenty of jobs in the United States, Americans aren’t willing to take them. He points the blame on a more-than-generous government safety net.

“We’ve taught people that in some cases it’s easier to be dependent, and you’re a sucker if you pound the pavement and work at one of those tough minimum wage jobs,” he told host Jeremy Hobson.

Listen to the interview above to hear from Stossel about why he thinks both the “help wanted index” and the unemployment numbers are higher than ever now.